Manabu (left) and Takumi (right) of “Kaminari,” who are steadily gaining popularity with their energetic, pounding manzai, have just the right balance. To be honest, there were parts that I didn’t take full advantage of. –I had not had the image of the two of them talking at length on TV programs, but when I recently listened to the radio program “Kaminari’s All Night Nippon PODCAST,” I thought the atmosphere of just the two of them talking was interesting. I thought that each of their characters came out and that Manabu-san talks quite a bit. Takumi: I heard that a lot from people who listened to the radio. In my opinion, it is normal for Manabu to talk, but even people who say they are our fans seemed to find it surprising that Manabu talked (laughs). (Laughs.) I’ve learned that people find that unexpectedness interesting, so I’m thinking of a project on YouTube where Manabu can talk passionately to the end. –I have the impression that Manabu is a bit of an enigma on TV. I don’t really understand his character. Takumi: Actually, Manabu is very adaptable. His personality and behavior changes depending on the site, the people, and the time of day. Sometimes I think he looks like an A, but he is an A’ (A-dash), and I still don’t know which one is the real one. Manabu: Depending on the program, there are times when Takumi is the blur and I am the facilitator, and there are times when I can’t do anything and suddenly become clueless, “What are you talking about now?” I can’t do anything, so I suddenly become clueless. The bigger the show, the more likely I am to be used that way. –Is that something you do consciously? Or does it happen naturally? Manabu: It comes naturally to me.   –That’s why I don’t know what kind of person you are. Takumi: But at the core, I am Manabu. So, it’s my fault too, but sometimes I don’t even notice the change. When I was listening to Manabu talking normally, one of the senior members around me said to me, “Takumi-kun, aren’t you going to pick up on that?” I was told, “Oh, now Manabu is talking out of turn.” I was like, “Oh, Manabu was just making fun of me?” I was like, “Oh, now Manabu is making fun of me?” The comment that was required was, “You don’t talk so much, do you?” But Manabu was not so sure. But Manabu wasn’t trying to invite it, so he didn’t understand that he had to make a comment. Manabu: Since I didn’t have a set character, I had different kinds of jobs. I would go to a children’s show in the morning, and the next day I would be on location for a vegetable gardening show on NHK, and when I came home in the evening, I would be talking about marijuana with a rapper. It makes me crazy. Takumi: That’s really true. I’m probably a bit strange for saying that. Manabu: I think that the current style of manzai is the one that is just barely within the limits of what Takumi can tame me. He would smack me on the head and not say anything unnecessary. So, I think the current style is working well because it is within the limits of what Takumi can handle. Takumi: So I am very grateful for the current style, but to be honest, I think I have been killing Manabu too much.