Daigo Iizuka, who has been involved in many popular programs such as “Downtown Wednesday,” “Gurunai,” and “Hirunandesu! ……, will be revived for the first time in 10 years and will be held on January 22 as “Tsubuzoroshii 2023.” The independent live concert by Daigo Iizuka, a writer involved in numerous popular programs, will be held on January 22. The performers include popular comedians such as Sanshiro, Westland, Love Letters, and Magical Lovely Murakami, who were regulars at this live show at that time.

The revival of the “legendary” live “Tsubuzu Zororoi” show. We asked Mr. Iizuka, who is at the forefront of the industry, about the “present and future” of TV and comedy, as well as behind-the-scenes details.

Popular comedians appearing in “Tsubuzu Zororoi

The “Tsubuzu Zororoi” cast includes: Sanshiro / Magical Lovely Murakami / Westland / Love Letters / Po-Choppu / R Fujimoto / Kishitakano / Mikazuki Manhattan / Bonheita Hamamura The show starts at 6 pm on Sunday, 1/22. Tickets for the show are sold out, but there will be tickets available for delivery (see for details).

(Please check https://event.1242.com/events/tsubuzoroi2023/ for details)

Was that a “bad manzai”?

–As soon as the revival of “Tsubuzu Zororoi” was announced, the tickets were sold out immediately. Many now successful comedians will perform, but I think the most noteworthy is Westland, winner of last year’s “M-1 Grand Prix 2022”.

Mr. Iizuka has a close relationship with Westland, having worked with Mr. Iguchi on serials and talk events, as well as on his solo live performances and the composition of “Westland’s All Night Nippon. First of all, please tell us about Westland’s M-1 victory. Their material was controversial because it was called “bad-mouthing manzai,” which is the opposite of “laughter that doesn’t hurt people.

Iizuka: Well, I feel that different people see their material in different ways. People who have seen the transition of Westland up to the present know that their material is not just snide remarks about others, but rather self-deprecating “envy and jealousy. However, those who did not know that might have thought that “a guy who suddenly appeared on the scene was swearing at all kinds of things as he pleased.

–I thought that when Iguchi-san shouted, “Oh, Mr. Sakuma! is probably what Iguchi really thinks about comedy fans and the comedy scene. But when he criticizes a romantic movie at the beginning of the story, he himself is not being punished for anything, but he is setting the scene for himself, isn’t he?

Iizuka: I guess I was able to do that because I made it a “yes-no” quiz. Until now, I used to say things like “girls are terrible” because I was not popular with girls, or swear about things that actually harmed me, but by making it an “Aruwanashi Quiz,” I was able to say bad things about people and events that were not directly related to me. This has greatly expanded the range of our material, and it has become a story that enjoys the ridiculousness of people swearing at everything, rather than a story that demands sympathy from the viewer.

–In Westland’s manzai, it was mentioned that “comedy fans who analyze the material are annoying,” but the number of people who watch M-1 and share their opinions on SNS or write articles analyzing the material has been increasing every year, hasn’t it? What do you think about this trend as someone who is also involved in comedy shows?

Iizuka: Criticism and analysis are interesting. I feel that the reason why M-1 analysis has become unusually popular is due to the fact that entertainment has become more diversified, and as a result, there is less and less content that everyone watches in common.

Westland won the M-1 championship in 22 years with a dramatic catch-up (from the M-1 Grand Prix 2022 official website).

–Personally, I think anyone is free to say whatever they want about comedy, but I don’t really like people who use comedy as a pretext to write endlessly about their own arguments that are not directly related to it. I don’t like people who use comedy as a springboard to write about other things.

Iizuka: Among those who write about comedy, there are those who genuinely like comedy and want to convey the fun of it or hope that what they write will have some positive effect on the comedy world, and there are those who just use comedy as a “subject” to convey what they want to say, regardless of that. I think there are people who just use comedy as “a subject to convey what they want to say” regardless of that.

–There are people who just use comedy as “a subject to convey their point” regardless of the subject matter. If you do that, it can be taken as if the comedian’s true intentions, even though he is just telling a joke.

Iizuka: All comedians say this, but basically they are just doing it to impress the audience. I feel sorry for them if they are burdened with the thought that there might be a message behind it. I think that Westland’s style of manzai will stop when it is no longer popular, and if it is popular, it must be in tune with the current times. Comedians are the most sensitive to changes in the atmosphere, as they are the ones who know when a certain material or phrase is no longer popular.

Walking the fine line

–I heard that female comedians have stopped doing “appearance teasing” material more and more, not because the times have changed, but because it is no longer popular. This is what Amako Inter’s Makiko said when I interviewed her.

Iizuka: Fukuda (Maki) of “Heroine at 3 o’clock” also said that. She said that she wrote about it on Twitter because she felt that such material was no longer popular. I think the times have changed, and it is no longer popular.

–I think the times have changed, and it is no longer popular.

Iizuka: It is difficult to draw a line, but I feel that comedians are still making fun of things that they cannot clearly imagine that would make someone sad or angry.

When I watch comedy, even if it has nothing to do with me, I wonder, “Is it okay to say this…? I wonder if some people will be offended by this…?” Even if it has nothing to do with you, it is difficult to laugh when you have these thoughts in your mind for even a moment. This naturally makes it harder to talk about the topic. I think that Westland is very good at recognizing when it is okay and walking right on the edge of that line.

–When a comedian goes on stage, he or she is faking the impression of how he or she looks, and since that is the premise for his or her material, it is naturally impossible to ignore that impression. I’ve done shows such as “Marco Polori! (Kansai Television), Koji Higashino rags on Westland’s Iguchi-san’s appearance, but no one complains, right? I guess it also depends on the person.

Iizuka: With Mr. Iguchi, it seems that no matter how much he is beaten up, not many people get angry. I think Iguchi’s fans would rather say, “Thank you very much for bullying him. If that happens, it will be very strong. Nadal and Kuro are the best examples. No matter what they do, no one says anything.

–In the end, surprise jobs will go only to people like that.

Iizuka: It’s invisible, but it’s like a license to surprise. There is a character and an atmosphere in which people do not feel sorry for you even if you surprise them. Actually, this is not something that everyone has, so only those who have the license can pull off a surprise. The viewers share the unspoken understanding that “these people have all the licenses,” so they can watch the show with peace of mind.

— Along with people saying that “appearance teasing is not good,” people often say these days that “painful laughter is not good. Last year, the BPO issued an opinion on this subject, which also became a hot topic. Regarding this, is there actually a voluntary movement among TV productions not to do such things, or is it being stopped because of the judgment that it is not popular with today’s viewers?

Iizuka: I think there are both, just like the criteria for judging a comedian’s material. There are, of course, those who say, “Well, it gets a lot of criticism, so we should stop doing it. Recently, when I see a harsh punishment game or something like that, it’s not so much that I don’t like it, but rather that I worry, “Will this cause a firestorm? and that is why they can’t laugh anymore. If it’s not going to be funny, then why play it at all?

–I think it’s true that, like the audience I mentioned earlier, when I watch TV, I think it’s fine, but when I think, “I wonder if there are people who would be offended by this,” that makes me lose interest in the show.

Iizuka: Lately, when I watch a comedy show at an award show, the moment a song starts playing, I think to myself, “I wonder if this can be distributed without modification due to copyright restrictions.” I was thinking, “I can’t play this song as it is for copyright reasons. It has nothing to do with the content of the material, but if I think about unnecessary things, I lose my concentration.”

–While this competition has attracted attention because it is a women-only comedy contest, some people have questioned whether it is appropriate to separate the qualifications for participation by gender. Iizuka: In the first place, the comedy world is a very diverse one.

Iizuka: The comedy world has always been a male-dominated society, so I think it has been difficult for female comedians to compete in some areas. For example, at show auditions, female comedians were told that they should do material from a woman’s perspective, as a matter of course. I think it was partly a survival strategy, because there were so many male comedians that they had no choice but to do so in order to leave a lasting impression, but the range of their material was limited. The audience inevitably had a “female comedian” bias.

But with “THE W,” only female comedians participate, so there is no need to worry about that. In the first and second years of “THE W,” there were a lot of female comedians who did stories that took advantage of the fact that they were women, such as “There are women in their twenties,” or stories about appearance, but now the range of stories seems to have expanded. In that sense, I think there is significance in the existence of these competitions.

What TV can do now

–I think that the TV industry around 2011 had fewer comedy shows than now, and more programs were aimed at middle-aged and older viewers. It is said that this has changed over the years, and TV stations have come to focus more on core viewership ratings (individual viewership ratings among 13-49 year olds) and have started to make programs for the younger generation. When and how did this change occur?

Iizuka: It is often said that up until a certain point in time, the focus was on “household viewership ratings,” so many programs were tailored to the senior demographic, which has a large percentage of TV viewers. However, from a certain period, some stations began to use core viewership data to appeal to sponsors, saying, “This is how many young people watch our programs,” even if the household viewership ratings were not good, and adopted the strategy of “making programs for young people as much as possible. The success of “Ariyoshi’s Wall” was also a boost, and I think that for a while there was an increase in the number of programs especially for young people.

Recently, however, it seems that it is not good just making programs for young people, and I think things are returning to the way they were before. Especially in prime time, I think people are thinking, “Let’s make programs that can be watched by everyone, from children to the elderly. On the other hand, in the late-night time slot, there is a trend toward making outrageous programs that will be talked about on the Internet.

–In today’s TV industry, there are other criteria for evaluation besides simple ratings, such as how much buzz a program has generated on SNS or how many views it has received on TVer. Do those things affect the rating of a program?

Iizuka: This may be a misnomer, but I think that in order for a program to continue, it is important to have a reason not to end it. If the program is getting ratings, which is the most important evaluation criteria, of course it will not end, and if it is a program with a popular MC, it would be a waste to end it right away. There is also the feeling that you can’t end a program that won the Galaxy Award the following month, and sometimes the reason is because it’s a hot topic on the Internet. After all, no one wants the program they are working on to end, so I think they can argue various reasons for not ending it.

–The world of television is changing rapidly, but what do you think will happen in 2023?

Iizuka: I think there will be an increase in long-running, large-scale special programs that are broadcast live. These are festive programs with a sense of scale, such as “THE MUSIC DAY,” “Comedy Day,” and “FNS Rough & Music. TV stations want people to watch in real time, but it is difficult to get people talking about a show if it is broadcast live for one or two hours. So, I think that such strategies as “We will be broadcasting live for 6 hours on this day, so please watch,” or something like that, will increase the elements that will be talked about and increase the opportunities for viewers to watch.

–What do you think the comedy industry will be like in 2023?

Iizuka: At one time, a gag by a comedian was nominated for the “buzzword of the year” award every year, but I have a feeling that there will not be many comedians who make a big breakthrough with a bang. I don’t mean that in a bad way, but I think that there will be a situation where all powerful comedians will have a certain amount of work.

Instead, there will be a lot of people who are able to sell well in their respective genres, such as those who can make a living by performing live to an audience, or those who can make a living by getting a certain amount of views on YouTube. I think there will be a lot of people who can sell well in their respective genres. I see the ecological sphere of comedians expanding.

I also feel that the viewers need to be literate enough to read the context of the show, as I have been feeling recently when I watch the M-1 competition. I sometimes wonder, “Is this really a story that everyone in the audience can understand? I feel that comedy may be moving from mass culture to a different stage.

For example, in the field of animation, there are fewer national cartoons that can be enjoyed by both children and adults, and more cartoons that are aimed at people who like cartoons have become more mature as a culture.

–I can’t say that the current trend in the comedy world is a good thing or a bad thing.

Iizuka: This is exactly what is happening in the world of student comedy. There are not many people who say, “I do it to be popular. In the past, it was difficult to say, I love comedy! I think there were a lot of people who said I do it to be popular to hide their embarrassment.

–Also, recently, independent teams such as Saraba Seishun no Hikari and Lalande, which are not affiliated with a big firm, have been able to work at their own pace. In the past, I think it would have been like, “If you don’t belong to a big firm, you can’t appear on TV anymore, so that’s the end of it,” but that change has been significant, too.

Iizuka: In the old days, whether you appeared on TV or not was all that mattered, so I think the power of the agency was also significant. There are people who are talked about in such places and then they appear on TV.

The strength of being able to afford it

–I think you are doing a lot of terrestrial TV work at the moment.

Iizuka: As long as I have work, I want to do it, but when it’s gone, I’ll have to do something else. I don’t think that terrestrial TV is absolutely necessary.

Still, I feel the appeal of terrestrial TV work every day. Nowadays, if a YouTuber takes a TV project, nothing is said, but if a YouTuber’s project is similar to a TV project, people say, “TV took it. I think this means that TV is still considered to have a superior ability to create content.

Recently, some distribution services have been producing variety shows. These companies have great marketing power, so they can say, “Our viewers like this kind of thing, so we won’t make anything that doesn’t fit their needs. They make a clear decision based on the data whether or not to make a program. Both the talent and the producer have to have a proven track record to get a project through. This makes it difficult to experiment.

In this respect, I think TV is weak in marketing, in a positive sense. Therefore, there is still a “this may not get the message, but it’s interesting, so let’s give it a try,” kind of vibe, and because of that, there is a foundation for creating something strange. I think it is because of television that a completely unknown director can suddenly create a strange program using program production funds. This is the strength and interest of television. I would like to continue working in television because I still want to do things that are considered innovative.

–I would like to continue working in television because I would like to continue doing things that are considered innovative. However, there is a good thing about being forced to do something. I thought that was true.

Iizuka: The subject of a celebrity’s YouTube channel is the celebrity, because he or she is doing it on his or her own. But celebrities are all shy, so I think it’s actually easier to say, “I’m doing this because of this project.

-There’s an interestingness that comes from that, isn’t there? It’s like, “That’s why we’re doing it, we have no choice.

Iizuka: I think YouTube is suitable for people like Atsuhiko Nakata and Akihiro Nishino, who have the ability to communicate and have something to say.

–Lastly, I would like to ask you about the “Tsubuzoroi 2023” comedy live show that you are hosting for the first time in 10 years.

Iizuka: It sounds good to say “……,” but it’s just a coincidence. To put a value on this live concert, it might be better to say that “all the people who sold later were on the stage.

–Iizuka: I don’t think it was a coincidence that Westland, which was scheduled to perform at this show, won the M-1 contest after it was decided to hold this show.

Iizuka: I didn’t think they would win either. I didn’t think it would go so well. It made the “legendary live” experience even more special. It was thanks to Westland.

–What are you planning to do in this “legendary live performance”?

Iizuka: In addition to each comedian’s own material, we are also planning to do some comedy and projects that transcend the boundaries of the duo, and since it will be the first time in 10 years, we want to do something that will overflow with the feelings of everyone over the past 10 years. I would also be happy if this live concert can draw even more attention to the performers and add to the legendary atmosphere of the event.

The “Tsubuzu Zorairo” performers: Sanshiro / Magical Lovely Murakami / Westland / Love Letters / Po-Choppe / R Fujimoto / Kishitakano / Mikazuki Manhattan / Bonheita Hamamura The show starts at 6pm on Sunday, 1/22. Tickets for the show are sold out, but tickets for delivery are available. For more information, please check https://event.1242.com/events/tsubuzoroi2023/ ]

The “Legendary Live” is Back After a 10-Year Absence!

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